>> Should I have a logo design first or after?
>
>Neither.
>
>You should have some business strategy created first. In doing this, you will gain some insights as to what your full branding strategy needs to be. A branding strategy will include a wide range of elements depending on your business and strategy.
>
>Ultimately, it will include both a logo and a web site and, since neither have been created yet, it'd make the most sense that they are created in unison along with the overall brand identity.

I agree with DA01. It is more expensive to build something **without** a business strategy then to build one **with** one. Also, the golden rule in design is that form always follows function. The function of the business is, ultimately, to be profitable and self-sustaining. If a start-up doesn't have the patience to figure out if it will be profitable, kill it now and save a lot of money.

>While i do agree with this, i think its a bit naive to think startups have the time, money and patience to do it this way. Usually there are outside forces that make it impossible to do it this way. 

That's actually what makes a business strategy even more important. As a start-up, you can't afford to fail. 9/10 start-ups fail. Market validation is a way to spend 5% of your budget up front figuring out what your product is instead of blowing 50% plus of it on logos, design, lawyers, office space, marketing.

I'm a graphic designer with an MBA working on a start-up and felt compelled to help point people in the right direction. I can't comment because I just signed up to StackExchange to help on this one. please see *[Market Validation: Why Ready, Aim, Fire Beats Ready, Fire, Fire, Fire, Aim][1]* for an eloquent argument.


  [1]: http://www.inc.com/rob-adams/market-validation-new-book.html